Is there any relation between the frame numbers and the chassis serials?

All chassis, engine, axle, geabox numbers can be found in Jack Du Gan’s “Type 43 register and data book”

One of the things I most appreciate about Jack du Gan is his refusal to speculate; only verified facts, provided by co-operative and generous owners, went into his book. The downside is that some fabulous T43's went more-or-less undocumented, The Schlumf Collection refused point blank to divulge so much as a chassis number, for instance, and Julian Majzub, owner of a fantastically original T43 with custom 2-seater roadster body, also refused to play ball.

To indulge my vindictive nature to the full, herewith all the information about his T43 I could gather :



Current Owner : Julian Majzub esq.
First Owner : Reinart Leuttich, delivered to him Jan 1929
Registration Number : K 6861
Chassis Number : 43248
Engine Number : 93 (Original engine)
Engine Number : 9 ex 43164 (Engine currently fitted)
Assembly Number : 23S
Gearbox Number : unknown
Rear axle Number : unknown
Oil filter base Number : C28 ex 35B
Steering Box : R
Compressor Number : 85
Compressor Drive Number : 37
Frame Number : 93
Carrozzeria : Eugene Matthys of Brussels (From WIKI - not mentioned in du Gan)
Front Axle Number : unknown
Cambox Number : 39

To answer your original question Michael : It would seem not, for instance 43155 has frame number 10 (also engine number 10) while 43172 (engine number 12) has frame number 7. 43222 eng. 73 has frame number 67 while the highest chassis number recorded by the author is 43310, eng. 152 (now L137 ex 49237) and it has frame number 152.

Kind Regards
Johan Buchner

MAJZUB, Fuad.

An international accountant associated with the Shah of Iran who was especially interested in Rileys and Bugattis. He rebuilt the single-seater ex-Stubberfield 35B he acquired from Frank Wall in 1982. The car was originally the 1926 factory team car with chassis no. 4848 and engine 120T. When acquired it was in a very well-worn condition after being raced by Hamish Moffat. He resisted the temptation to return the car to its original 2 seater form. He also owned a type 44 (44266 with engine 32) purchased from Eric Stewart in 1982. Five years later he imported a type 43 from America, a car (43192) which was said to have been the personal property of Lidia Bugatti. He also owned cars 4378, 4662, 43248, 44787, 49133 with engine L280 ; a four-seat DHC imported from Belgium in 1981) and a type 51 replica. He competed at Prescott twice with best times of 48.77 and 59.18 sec. He lived at St. Leonard’s Grange, Beoley, Redditch, Worcestershire but died prematurely on 28th January, 1995.

Okay, thanks so far.
Where at the frame is the number stamped? And is there also a frame stamping with the chassis number? Normally the chassis plate is fixed to the firewall, how to identify a car if body incl. firewall is removed / missing?

Hi Michael

From du Gan I've gleaned the following :

You are quite right, the chassis number does appear on the bulkhead mounted brass plaque, together with, in the case of the T43, the legend 13hp. On the lower crankcase, near the back engine bearer arm this number is repeated, while the corresponding engine number, together with the assembly number, appears near the front bearer arm. It would appear that the engine number is repeated on the upper crankcase, oil-filter flange, the super-charger casing and to the rear of the super-charger itself.

The transmission and rear-axle numbers, both with numbers usually close to that of the engine, have theirs stamped into the casings, and in the case of the transmission, also on the lid.

The frame number is stamped into the rear channel section cross-member, usually, but not always, upside down and in the middle. The front axle is usually stamped upper middle, although a surprising number of cars' front axle have no number. Davis Sewell speculates that in the case of the Bob Roberts car, 43159, the number may simply have been polished out during restoration.

Michael, a while ago I asked you for a reference about "Memoirs of a Bugatti Hunter" and you recommended it unreservedly; thus I ordered a copy, and I enjoy the reminiscing of this quite remarkable man very much indeed. Allow me to return the favour, the Jack du Gan book, Bugatti Type 43 Register and Data Book, is, not only, the only book which deals specifically with the T43, but is also written by an enthusiastic owner of a T43. It contains the development and racing history, together with practical tips on the maintenance of a T43. Strangely enough, this section makes for thoroughly enjoyable reading, even to non-owners.

The bulk of the book is made up of individual histories of the 162 cars built (Roughly half of which survive). Strangely enough, as with the Bob King book on the Brescia, the owners of non-original cars and those restored from a pile of bits, proved most co-operative. At the back, a section dealing with the replicas makes for the most entertainment.

A thoroughly worthwhile book and best of all, spread throughout there are photos of unknown and/or untraced cars. I fully expect a second edition to clear up these mysteries.

Kind Regards
Johan Buchner

PS. To CGL Wales, in the May 2008 edition of Classis & Sports Car, in an article about the Paul Russell restored Mercedes Benz 540K Autobahn-Kurier, Julian Majzub mentions the Iranian domiciled Autobahn-Kurier bought by his father (believed to be the Berlin Show-Car) which, he believes, should stay in Iran, preferably in a local museum. Thereby, of course, ensuring that no Jew or homosexual will ever lay eyes on it. Needless to say, Majzub did not even provide as much as a snap-shot of this fabled car. Perhaps you can post his home-address on this forum? I have a goodwill package to send him.

Johan, thanks a lot.
To be honest, there is only one Bugatti model which really interests me, and that is the type 35 GP car, including the T, B, C 39 and 51 versions. Plus the T53, T54 and T59. Or in other words - everything with 8 cylinders which was built purely for racing. With the T35A and the T37/37A as tolerated sideline.

The road cars are nice to look at, but they don't really interest me from a research view. Only in this special case I'm trying to find out the identity / history of a specific T43 because the owner asked me to do so.

I understand Michael, your files on the T35/51 and derivatives (together with a select few other contributors') are a never-ending source of knowledge and delight. I for one am most grateful for your and the other's generosity. Should you need any info on road-cars, I can help with the following : Brescia 16 valve; Royale; T43; soon T46 and my great love, the T57S.

Having access to knowledge is one thing, but sharing it with others is a uniquely satisfying way to give meaning to my library. To answer your query I had to read Du Gan with a renewed intensity, result? A renewed appreciation for Jack du Gan and David Sewell (Many Sewell reports on individual cars are included). Thank you.

Regards
Johan