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T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.
http://www.bugattibuilder.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2102
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Author:  Lazarus [ Thu Jul 29, 2010 6:21 pm ]
Post subject:  T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

There is a wonderful article in the french magazine Retroviseur this month.Unfortunately it doesn't mention the person [me] who restored the chassis ! Crossthwaite and Gardner get the credit.I suppose it has increased the sale price of the car.Sadly the article is a work of fiction.The car cannot be 43186 and the chassis is replica [much patina but replica nonetheless] I changed the diffcase which was in any event T35/51 not T43.The non destructive testing showed up the actual number of the sump as opposed to the number stamped by presumably Geordino. The rear leg of the sump had got broken off so the original number there had gone,the number stamped in the wrong place was in modern number stamping not Bugatti numbers.Non Destructive Testing found the actual motor number on the front nearside leg of the sump which had been deliberately erased .The actual sump came from a T43 known to have been in Marseille in 1980 [according to BOC records] The car is a built up car with many original and good parts but it is not 43186 and the only part that I am confident about from 186 is the gearbox,The owner had stamped 186 EVERYWHERE !!

Author:  Herman [ Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

Trade for a matching numbers Ford Mondeo? :twisted:

At least good to make a note in the wiki

Author:  davids [ Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

Bonsoir Lazarus, I will go and get a copy from my local tabac/presse in Cazals on sunday market...
am sure it will make a reasonable afternoons reading.
desole que vos efforts n'etait pas reconnu...
David

Author:  Lazarus [ Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

davids wrote:
Bonsoir Lazarus, I will go and get a copy from my local tabac/presse in Cazals on sunday market...
am sure it will make a reasonable afternoons reading.
desole que vos efforts n'etait pas reconnu...
David

quelqun a fais une histoire qui donne valeur a cette voiture....c'est pas honete.j'ai une belle voiture a vendre sur ebay...http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... :MESELX:IT

Author:  ard [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

There are rumours, tha the car is the #43158 and not the #43186

Author:  bugatti69 [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

The frame of the 43158 could be still at Giordano. It had been before recovered by Dovaz, then stolen or disappeared, would have been found under mysterious conditions at Cornière, and is sold to Giordano with other original parts of the 43158, as being 43186 !!!!
Dovaz would always have the Carte Grise of the 43158.
The '43186' on “Rétroviseur” is not the 43186, it is a rebuilt type 43 which would use original parts of various source on a nondefinite frame.

It is not certain that it uses original parts of the 43158. It is only one assumption.

Author:  bugatti69 [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 11:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

See the updates on Wiki:

43186 : http://www.bugattiregister.com/wiki/ind ... itle=43186

43158 : http://www.bugattiregister.com/wiki/ind ... itle=43158

'43186' ; http://www.bugattiregister.com/wiki/ind ... 2743186%27

Author:  LANOS [ Tue Nov 23, 2010 10:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

Great work; now, the mess is clarified. Thanks!

Author:  Herman [ Tue Nov 23, 2010 4:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

nonononono, there is still the aftermath. Ard will come with an article in which the mess is unraveled.

Author:  ard [ Tue Nov 23, 2010 6:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

Give me just a few days. I'll wait if and under what conditions the car is auctioned. And what they do to Michel Dovaz and the bad article in the Retroviseur in july/august.

Author:  Lazarus [ Tue Nov 23, 2010 8:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

bugatti69 wrote:
The frame of the 43158 could be still at Giordano. It had been before recovered by Dovaz, then stolen or disappeared, would have been found under mysterious conditions at Cornière, and is sold to Giordano with other original parts of the 43158, as being 43186 !!!!
Dovaz would always have the Carte Grise of the 43158.
The '43186' on “Rétroviseur” is not the 43186, it is a rebuilt type 43 which would use original parts of various source on a nondefinite frame.

It is not certain that it uses original parts of the 43158. It is only one assumption.

The car that I restored is definately NOT 43158.Nor is it 43186.I honestly believe that the chassis of "43186" is new or mostly new.The rear axle I bought from the Uno Ranch auction several years ago [ the diffcase in the car bought from Geordino was GP so we changed it for a touring version] The gearbox is from 43186.The engine is new above the upper crankcase.The upper crankcase came from Andrew Crisford and was a T35 one bought years ago from Richard I'anson.The sump was subjected to forensic analysis and the obscured engine number was found to be 97 not 5 which it would be if the sump was from 43158.So no part of the engine is from 43158.The body,wheels,brakes, etc are all new so that leaves only the front axle no 172 which could be from 43158. BUT I think it far more likely that the front axle is from a T44 as it had never been polished as I think most T43 axles were.I believed right from the begining that Geordano kept the best bits of at least one original T43.It would appear likely that that is 43158.

Author:  ard [ Tue Nov 23, 2010 8:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

I just send the article to Herman

Author:  Herman [ Tue Nov 23, 2010 9:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

The article as Ard sent me.

Attachments:
43186 seems to be a stolen car of Michel Dovaz.pdf [533.08 KiB]
Downloaded 1214 times

Author:  onebugatti [ Tue Nov 23, 2010 11:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Carte Gris - No proof of ownership

Legally, a Carte Gris is NOT proof of ownership. Only a Certificate de Cession mets the legal definition of an ownership claim. For many years the french - and certain dealers - withheld these documents from overseas buyers, only to later road register unknown and replica cars on duplicate Carte Gris - an illegal practice but tolerated because non-french have little chance of a court claim against it , based on no damages. The Court views that a Carte Gris is a French administrative document only - property of the Republic .

Even if it is forged, it's legally worthless and yet valuable at Retromobile !

An active Police report is a positive first step.

Author:  Lazarus [ Wed Nov 24, 2010 2:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: T43 article in Retroviseur july/aug 2010.

Herman wrote:
The article as Ard sent me.

Ard is quite and totally WRONG as you will have deduced from my previous comments on this thread.John Barton.

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