Whose type 32?

Skiff · **Joined:** Sat Jul 17, 2010 1:42 pm **Posts:** 12

On the Corre - La Licorne website (http://www.corre-lalicorne.com/en-course.html) I noticed a Bugatti Tank among the other competitors at the 1927 Grand Prix de la Marne. Does anyone know whose car this was?

Attachment:

1927depart.jpg [ 54.42 KiB | Viewed 8551 times ]

Lazarus · **Posted:** Mon Jan 31, 2011 6:18 pm

Is it a Bugatti ?

barttore · **Joined:** Wed Jul 15, 2009 5:38 pm **Posts:** 642

from: http://www.teamdan.com/archive/gen/1927.html#mar

III Grand Prix de la Marne
10 July 1927 - Reims: 400.00 km (8.00 km x 50 laps)
Formula Libre, Voiturette & Cyclecar Race
1 30 Philippe Etancelin Bugatti 35B 3h26m20.2, 116.31 kph
2 12 Michel Doré La Licorne 3h34m36.0 voiturette
3 14 Guy Drouet Bugatti 37A 3h39m05.2 voiturette
4 4 Philippe Auber Bugatti 37 3h42m08.4 voiturette
5 3 Albert Perrot Salmson 3h55m08.8 cyclecar
6 2 Robert Gauthier Bugatti 37 4h08m53.0 voiturette
7 9 Vincent Tersen Amilcar 4h10m03.2 cyclecar
8 40 Henri Tourbier Panhard Levassor 4h13m59.2
9 10 Delaplace SCAP 4h14m12.4 voiturette
10 25 Lemaitre EHP CIME 4h14m25.0 cyclecar
11 38 Pierre Bouchez Georges Irat 4h14m41.0
12 23 d'Isormes Aries 48 laps cyclecar
13 21 Max Fourny BNC 527 SCAP 45 laps cyclecar
14 35 Armand Girod Amilcar 40 laps cyclecar

Fastest Lap: Philippe Etancelin, 3m43.0 (129.15 kph)

Did Not Finish
11 Violette Morris BNC 527 SCAP 39 laps/Bodywork cyclecar
1 Antonio Valette Salmson 35 laps/Magneto cyclecar
17 Jacques Sejacq BNC 527 SCAP cyclecar
34 Emmanuel Babouin Bugatti 35
32 Raymond Leroy Bugatti 35
31 Yves Giraud-Cabantous Caban Ruby cyclecar
33 Lesbroussand Vamparys cyclecar
5 Van Hoof GAR Chapuis Dornier 4 laps cyclecar
15 Henri Billiet BNC 527 SCAP 4 laps cyclecar
37 Tetaldi Amilcar 1 lap cyclecar

Did Not Appear
6 Lespinesse Genestin
7 Lanciano Amilcar
8 Genestin Genestin
19 Gaupillat BNC 527
27 EHP
29 Derancourt Salmson
36 Clause Bignan Special

so only 37's and 35's

Skiff · **Joined:** Sat Jul 17, 2010 1:42 pm **Posts:** 12

I think Lazarus is correct, on closer examination it is different from the type 32. What is it?

Cris · **Joined:** Sun Aug 10, 2008 3:26 am **Posts:** 12

Based on its race number and the listing, it's a Bignan entered by Pierre Clause, though Bignans were mostly cyclecars and that tank appears to have far more substantial wheels.

Cris

Herman · **Posted:** Tue Feb 01, 2011 11:50 am

By that time the T32 was outdated. As the car looks very much like it (see the front corners) would it be possible that a T32 body was fitted on another car?

barttore · **Joined:** Wed Jul 15, 2009 5:38 pm **Posts:** 642

Hello Cris,

The Bignan is registered as "did not appear".
But the addition "special" makes me wonder too.
I agree it is almost sure not a Bugatti.

Maybe it is the Georges Irat ? They were pretty unconventional in their time.

It is not a Chenard Walcker or Amilcar tank- the models I know of look different.

I do not know if there were ever any Salmson tank-bodied cars ?

Lazarus · **Posted:** Tue Feb 01, 2011 12:26 pm

barttore wrote:

Hello Cris,

The Bignan is registered as "did not appear".
But the addition "special" makes me wonder too.
I agree it is almost sure not a Bugatti.

Maybe it is the Georges Irat ? They were pretty unconventional in their time.

It is not a Chenard Walcker or Amilcar tank- the models I know of look different.

I do not know if there were ever any Salmson tank-bodied cars ?

There were certainly tank bodied Salmsons.My good friend Rheinhard List has one in austria.It has appeared on the Enstal klassic.

Michael Müller · **Posted:** Wed Feb 02, 2011 12:02 am

Without any doubt Pierre Clause's 2 litre Bignan.

Lazarus · **Posted:** Wed Feb 02, 2011 10:57 am

Michael Müller wrote:

Without any doubt Pierre Clause's 2 litre Bignan.

Bugatti had a lot to answer for it seems !

barttore · **Joined:** Wed Jul 15, 2009 5:38 pm **Posts:** 642

Great that it is identified !
That leaves us 2 (new) questions:
- were the photos above of the 1927 Grand Prix de la Marne or another event ?
or
- are the results on the above website (probably based on the Sheldon/Rabagliati records-the one issue I don't have) incorrect ?

But being a Bugatti forum this need not be discussed further here.

Lazarus: if you have a photo of the tank bodied Salmson please post it: I searched Internet yesterday and checked Chris Draper's "Salmson Story" but did not find any pictures. Thank you.

Herman · **Posted:** Wed Feb 02, 2011 6:34 pm

Keep on discussing, worst that can happen is that I will move it into an off topic section.

Lazarus · **Posted:** Wed Feb 02, 2011 8:28 pm

Herman wrote:

Keep on discussing, worst that can happen is that I will move it into an off topic section.

As it is not a T32 Bugatti tank here are two shots of my daughters T37 just off behind a rope for its first [sucessful] test runs.The T73C gearbox is a delight.Based on the T57G le mans tank gearboxes it is quite different to the normel GP version.Syncromesh on all forward gears and a nice crisp change.So here is a GP without a hole in the body for the gearlever.

Michael Müller · **Posted:** Thu Feb 03, 2011 3:15 pm

barttore wrote:

That leaves us 2 (new) questions:
- were the photos above of the 1927 Grand Prix de la Marne or another event ?
or
- are the results on the above website (probably based on the Sheldon/Rabagliati records-the one issue I don't have) incorrect ?

As usual copied from Sheldon, but trying to correct a mistake may be a boomerang. Sheldon forgot to show Clause as DNF, and Galpin - obviously without reading the text - declared him DNA.

Cris · **Joined:** Sun Aug 10, 2008 3:26 am **Posts:** 12

There is a very faint "36" on the front of the car which corresponds to the number given to the Bignan in the entry form. Results slightly incorrect? (DNF/DNA/DNS)

Cris

Whose type 32?

Who is online