who were the replica/recreation specialists?

GCL-Wales · **Joined:** Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:17 pm **Posts:** 348

I tried to discuss Laurent's apparent claim to have made 250 engines when I spoke to him in Strasbourg in September but I found his accent a bit difficult to understand. Someone told me he speaks with a heavy Corsican accent. Perhaps someone who is more fluent in Fench could speak to him.

Something else I would like to know from him is where the chassis frame for the "type 13" car known as "1187" (or "Cyclops") came from.

Lupus · **Joined:** Tue Feb 17, 2009 6:02 pm **Posts:** 4

GCL-Wales wrote:

JONES, Ray. He is also believed to have owned some original cars including a type 35 (4448 with eng. no. 23) converted to 35C specification which he is thought to have sold in the early thirties*, a type 40 with chassis no. 40606 and engine no. 578 ex-40678, a type 43 (43280), and a type 51(51127).

Mixmaster Ray Jones has never owned 40606 !
That was a certain Mr. Robert Arthur Jones (UK). He owned 40606 in the 1960s.

GCL-Wales · **Joined:** Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:17 pm **Posts:** 348

Quite right. In 1973 Conway listed 40606 with R.Jones of Michigan but later substituted Birminhgam. My records show that the English Jones also owned car 37159. Do you know anything about him ?

amc · **Posted:** Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:55 pm

http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/video/193 ... ca/1418285
WOW. What do you think about these cars?
I'm surprised that the output of a T35 PurSang is 180HP!!!
Can it be registered in EU to drive legally?

Lazarus · **Posted:** Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:44 pm

amc wrote:

http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/video/1937-bugatti-type-35-pur-sang-replica/1418285
WOW. What do you think about these cars?
I'm surprised that the output of a T35 PurSang is 180HP!!!
Can it be registered in EU to drive legally?

No it cannot be registered in the eu to drive legally.

Herman · **Posted:** Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:36 am

I doubt that. The issue with the Dutch built Royale was that the owner did not want the remark "replica" in the paperwork.

Which, to me, indicates that if the owner would not care about that, he could register the Royale, which is not built according to current regulations (hydraulic brakes, sharp objects, etc).

Who knows more?

Lazarus · **Posted:** Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:26 pm

Herman wrote:

I doubt that. The issue with the Dutch built Royale was that the owner did not want the remark "replica" in the paperwork.

Which, to me, indicates that if the owner would not care about that, he could register the Royale, which is not built according to current regulations (hydraulic brakes, sharp objects, etc).

Who knows more?

Are you doubting my comment that it is impossible to legally register a new argentinian replica in the eu? I cannot register my daughters T37 here in france despite having molsheim axles and gearbox,steering box and pedal shaft.Plus much more original parts.I have spoken to the relevant goverment department and can confirm that there is NO legal way to register a PS in france.

Herman · **Posted:** Wed Sep 26, 2012 6:47 am

I definately do not doubt that. However, the dutch news article told another story.

I will inform about the Royale issue. I have some sources that worked on the issue from the "interesting" end. If it indeed was the addition of "replica" to the paperwork, this suggests the car in itself was allowed to register. If the car is a genuine replica, it should not be allowed on the streets according to current regulations.

This is why it is so interesting.

----
What about the BOC route? does a BC chassis number give possibilities?

Lazarus · **Posted:** Wed Sep 26, 2012 9:11 am

Herman wrote:

I definately do not doubt that. However, the dutch news article told another story.

I will inform about the Royale issue. I have some sources that worked on the issue from the "interesting" end. If it indeed was the addition of "replica" to the paperwork, this suggests the car in itself was allowed to register. If the car is a genuine replica, it should not be allowed on the streets according to current regulations.

This is why it is so interesting.

----
What about the BOC route? does a BC chassis number give possibilities?

If you are talking about the "prototype" royale built up in holland,then the case is quite different to the PS cars.The "dutch" Royale has many original parts and cannot be compared to a new PS.If the dutch authorities have accepted the chassis as genuine then there is no reason for the word replica to appear.

Brouillard · **Joined:** Tue Mar 11, 2008 11:48 pm **Posts:** 16

Perhaps Lazarus can explain to us dilletants the difference between a T37 having Molsheim axles, gearbox, steering box, pedal shaft, plus much more original parts, and the "prototype Royale" built up in Den Helder, allegedly having many original parts? It seems a bit incomprehensable that Lazarus advocates that the first cannot be legally admitted to the road in the EU, while the latter in his opinion should not be regarded as a replica.

Lazarus · **Posted:** Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:55 am

Brouillard wrote:

Perhaps Lazarus can explain to us dilletants the difference between a T37 having Molsheim axles, gearbox, steering box, pedal shaft, plus much more original parts, and the "prototype Royale" built up in Den Helder, allegedly having many original parts? It seems a bit incomprehensable that Lazarus advocates that the first cannot be legally admitted to the road in the EU, while the latter in his opinion should not be regarded as a replica.

You are quite right it is incomprehensible.However I did not say that I agree with the french authorities about my daughters car.In my opinion it should be possible to register, as Bugattis, cars which are built up from genuine bugatti parts.My daughters car passes the rules to get registered in the uk but not in france.As to the dutch Royale,If the chassis is genuine, then the car is not a replica.

Brouillard · **Joined:** Tue Mar 11, 2008 11:48 pm **Posts:** 16

Lazarus wrote:

As to the Dutch Royale. If the chassis is genuine, then the car is not a replica.

Have you seen an original chassis, or proof of it? At any rate the Dutch authorities haven't, and that includes other governement agencies in addition to the RDW.

octagonfox · **Joined:** Wed Aug 23, 2006 6:05 pm **Posts:** 232

Lazarus wrote:

If you are talking about the "prototype" royale built up in holland,then the case is quite different to the PS cars.The "dutch" Royale has many original parts and cannot be compared to a new PS.

What parts are original on the Dutch built "prototype" Royale?

Does anyone know who owns the car?

Herman · **Posted:** Fri Sep 28, 2012 6:53 am

No idea of the owner. I do know the chassis is "old" in terms of metallurgy, but do not know if it is Royale or even Bugatti.

Dutch crime lab did some testing.

Emmanuel Delahaye · **Joined:** Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:40 pm **Posts:** 1

GCL-Wales wrote:

"...depuis la création de VMI, en mars 1989, les lieux ont vu naitre 250 moteurs au bas mot." Raymond Couraud reporting on a visit to Rondoni's premises where he interviewed and photographed Laurent and his workers. There are at least fourteen cylinder blocks on the bench in one picture.

Bonsoir,

Avec retard (je découvre ce site seulement ce soir), permettez moi de corriger une erreur : l'article que vous citez est de moi, Emmanuel Delahaye, et non de mon collègue Raymond Couraud. Avec un troisième journaliste du quotidien régional "L'Alsace", Jacques Prost, nous avons co-signé en 2009 un hors-série consacré au centenaire de Bugatti. C'est dans ce cadre que j'étais aller rencontrer Laurent Rondoni à Carpentras. J'avais pour cela passé une journée entière sur place, avec lui et son fils Raphaël, ainsi qu'avec mon collègue photographe Denis Sollier. Pour l'anecdote, le passager de Raphaël Rondoni (fils de Laurent), qu'on aperçoit dans une Type 43 sur fond de mont Ventoux, p. 59 de ce hors-série, c'est moi...

Enfin, je ne peux pas être affirmatif - trois ans ont passés... - mais de mémoire, les 250 moteurs évoqués dans l'article sont à comprendre toutes marques confondues, et non pas juste pour Bugatti.

who were the replica/recreation specialists?

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