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 Post subject: 51125
PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:02 am 
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Posts: 2285
#16 GP de Monaco 1932, Archille Varzi, not with 3274-NV1, thus not 51125
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 Post subject: Re: 51125
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:35 am 
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Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2008 6:23 pm
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Uwe:
Please send me a private note so I can contact you off-line...I need to ask you about one of your photo posts.
Thanks,
Sandy


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 Post subject: Re: 51125
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:20 pm 
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Location: Bergen NH (NL)
As usual nobody is taking care about the topics here, which is understandable as nobody takes care what is written in the WIKI itself.

So let's start with Uwe's complaint.

Image

As one can see he is right - the registration is 3275-NV1.
So for sure it not 51125. But also not 51123 which was registered with this number, but more to this later. Let's continue with 51125.

Quote:
51125 was registered as a type 51A by the factory as 3274-NV1 at prefecture du Bas Rhin on 15th of April 1931.

51A? It was part of the 4 car sequence prepared and registered for the Monaco GP which took place on 19 April 1931:
3273-NV1 for 51124 with engine 5
3274-NV1 for 51125 with engine 8
3275-NV1 for 51123 with engine 3
3276-NV1 for 51122 with engine 1
Without any doubt the works cars for Monaco on 19 April 1931, for Varzi, Chiron, Divo and Bouriat. So who of them drove a T51A?

Quote:
Type 51 Grand Prix (ex Type 35C #4961)

All sources I know say 4961 became 51132, so what it the source of such statement?

Quote:
#18 IV° Grand Prix de Tunisie, Carthage, 3rd April 1932, Achille Varzi 1st

Did anybody care that Varzi's car there was registered 4924-NV1?

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Image

Quote:
#87 Mille Miglia, April 1932, Cazzaniga-Rosa

The Mille Miglia was only 1 week after Tunis. All sources - except the Bugatti Trust - say it was a T43, and by looking closely to the photo and especially the fullsize windscreen I also think this was a T43 GS.

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Quote:
#16 IV° Grand Prix de Monaco, 17th April 1932, Achille Varzi DNF (Automobiles Ettore Bugatti)

I commented this already above. But let me have a few words about the time line created here. Used by Varzi as red GP car at Tunis, one week later as sports car by Cazzaniga in the MM, and again one week later by Varzi as blue works car at Monaco. And then it went back to Cazzaniga because he used it also the 1933 Mille Miglia...


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 Post subject: Re: 51125
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 10:22 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2008 6:16 pm
Posts: 338
Michael Müller wrote:

Quote:
#87 Mille Miglia, April 1932, Cazzaniga-Rosa

The Mille Miglia was only 1 week after Tunis. All sources - except the Bugatti Trust - say it was a T43, and by looking closely to the photo and especially the fullsize windscreen I also think this was a T43 GS.


Michael, I agree with almost all you say here but the car is this picture is not a T43.
I have Molsheim drawings for a full width windscreen as an option for the T35. The right hand spare tire is leaning outwards to make room for the outside gearchange of the T35. The radiator is fitted too low for a T43 but is in T35 height.
Regards, Bugwrench


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 Post subject: Re: 51125
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:28 am 
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Posts: 434
Location: Bergen NH (NL)
As an owner of both you surely know better.
However, I sincerely doubt that this was 51125.


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 Post subject: Re: 51125
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:43 am 
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Posts: 434
Location: Bergen NH (NL)
Michael Müller wrote:
Did anybody care that Varzi's car there was registered 4924-NV1?

I have a note that 51125 was registered on 7 July 1931 as 4924-NV1. This would be a 2nd registration for same car and same owner within 3 months time. Can anybody confirm this? What was the background if correct?


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 Post subject: Re: 51125
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:42 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2007 1:12 pm
Posts: 2285
also interesting: #20 von Morgen with T54 right in the background
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 Post subject: Re: 51125
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:50 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2006 11:06 am
Posts: 789
Location: France
Michael Müller wrote:
Michael Müller wrote:
Did anybody care that Varzi's car there was registered 4924-NV1?

I have a note that 51125 was registered on 7 July 1931 as 4924-NV1. This would be a 2nd registration for same car and same owner within 3 months time. Can anybody confirm this? What was the background if correct?


#18 IV° Grand Prix de Tunisie, Carthage, 3rd April 1932, Achille Varzi 1st, with 4924-NV1, could be 51136 registered on 15 July 1931, then 8420-NV1 in May 1932


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