Bugattibuilder.com forum
http://www.bugattibuilder.com/forum/

Another Galibier bites the dust.
http://www.bugattibuilder.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1278		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Johan Buchner [ Wed Feb 04, 2009 7:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Another Galibier bites the dust.
In the previous thread about the Aerolithe, contributors Mark, Jaap and Mike spoke about their displeasure at the fashion for destroying (mostly) closed bodies in favour of racier (again, mostly) open recreations. I share their sentiments so much I thought that a separate thread cataloguing the Bugattis so affected might be a good idea. Strangely enough, one of the saddest incidents for me personally does not involve a Bugatti, but an Alfa Romeo 8C2.3 bodied by Touring with an exquisite coupé body which was removed in favour of some type of racing body. Apparently the chassis had a Le Mans history and the owner wanted to "restore" it to that configuration. It was such a beautiful car that Pocher made a large scale model of it, or its sister car, I'm not quite sure. Quite sad really.

Anyway, to start the ball rolling may I draw your attention to the WIKI inscription for a Type 57 Galibier, chassis number 57476. As you can see from the photos it now has a brand new TT body, made by Rod Jolley. According to renowned author and historian, Ard op de Weegh, the Galibier body was removed and destroyed by one Peter Schmitz even though the ash frame was still in reasonably good condition. The great Jean Prick did manage to save the following : (since my technical Dutch is a little rusty, I include the original term and what I think the correct English translation is. Corrections will be most welcome.) motorkap - bonnet, voorschermen - front wings and de portieren - the doors.

It was the next owner, Paul Engelen who contracted Rod Jolley to construct and fit the present coachwork, and in this configuration car and owner partook in the 2004 Mille Miglia. In 2005 57476 moved to its current owner, name unknown, in Austria. This car was one of Michel Dovaz's Sleeping Beauties and as can be seen from the photos she did look a little rough, but not many of these 2nd Series Galibiers survive, so it does seem a pity. M. Dovaz had the following to say about the fate of this rare car : "Le simulacre qu'on en a fait est particulièrement stupide." This does not translate well into either Dutch or English, but suffice to say, he's less than keen.

ImageImage
Image

Let us have some more sad tales of wanton destruction. Let us remember.

Kind Regards
Johan Buchner
Author:  octagonfox [ Wed Feb 04, 2009 8:51 pm ]
Post subject: 
Back to the topic. :lol:

Image

substituted by

Image

Unbelievable (personal opinion).

More info: http://www.bugattibuilder.com/wiki/index.php?title=57627

Dovaz discussion split into a seperate thread, see http://www.bugattibuilder.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1279
Author:  DJ Dirk [ Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
octagonfox wrote:
Back to the topic. :lol:

Image



oh my, that one looks amazing
now is that the Coupe Gangloff?
Author:  Greg Morgan [ Wed Feb 04, 2009 11:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
Going at this from a completely opposite direction, how in their right mind could anyone discard the Esders roadster body- possibly one of the most fabulous pieces of coachwork ever and replace it with the Binder Coupe De Ville, itself a rather poor imitation of the coupe Napoleon.
Author:  hortig78rpm [ Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:01 am ]
Post subject: 
in " bugattis in australasia" the story of the gangloff coupe was described as: in later years the body had become weak.....
instead of the TT body on the ex-douvaz car, which looks very correct ( the car is extensivly used here in austria ) the T59 like australian body
on the gangloff chassis is very ugly. you can see the, for me wrong lines in above mentioned book, for there is a photo showing the complete
car from the side ( excuse my austrian english).
Ive always wondered, why this beatifull gangloff body never has been copied, for its extremly beatiful.

mike
Author:  J.J.Horst [ Thu Feb 05, 2009 9:24 am ]
Post subject: 
Some more (From Jacob Munkhammar's site):

Bugatti Type 43 with Figoni et Falaschi cabriolet body.
The new owner didn't like it.
Photo (not included yet!): Eri Richardson, Source: H.G.Conway "BUGATTI - le pur-sang des automobiles"

In the members' magazine of the Bugatti Owners' Club, "Bugantics", winter 1995/6 issue, we can read Henry Posner proudly telling about how he "restored" his Type 43.
The car wore a Figoni et Falaschi body that the owner thought too top heavy, and too ugly. He replaced it with a replica of a completely standard Grand Sport body.

A replica of a standard factor body the car wore for a few years, or an original and unique one-off body, by a master coach builder, that the car had worn for more than 50 years; which is most interesting?

Where is the pride of driving something unique - and original?
Author:  LANOS [ Fri Feb 27, 2009 11:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Another Galibier bites the dust.
I agree; it is a shame what has happened to this car.

When I first saw this car 57476 on the wiki I supposed that the original body had been preserved to be sold for someone interested in fitting an original body instead a replica body. I think that more money could have been received selling the complete body than destroying it. Even the windscreen was still unbroken. And it was indeed a very rare body; I hesitate if more second series Galibier have survived.

I cannot understand why so many Galibier bodies which could have been preserved have been destroyed. I find very attractive this body, with its rounded and very modern looking shape. Besides, a Galibier should be more valuable than other versions, since few were built and many fewer have survived.
Author:  T44lover [ Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another Galibier bites the dust.
This thread is surely 'up my street'! I totally deplore the practice of rebodying pre-war cars of any make with replica bodies. As far as I'm concerned there is no such thing as an original body that is beyond repair - if you can make a new one then you can repair the old one. As far as Bugattis are concerned I would go so far as to say that they are no longer real Bugattis once they have been rebodied.
The Galibier is a fine looking car but, of course, posers want to be seen and they can't be seen without the wind in their hair and the top down. That the practice goes on even today is appalling and it should be discouraged. It is rather like painting Madonna's face on the Mona Lisa because you think it will impress your friends as it is more beautiful.
The body on my car has not been off the chassis since it was built in 1929 despite over 300,000 miles. I don't stay at home because it rains but I do try to ensure that all the joints are waterproof since leaks are death to a Weymann body.


The older I get the better I was!
John S
Author:  Lazarus [ Thu Mar 05, 2009 2:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another Galibier bites the dust.
T44lover wrote:
This thread is surely 'up my street'! I totally deplore the practice of rebodying pre-war cars of any make with replica bodies. As far as I'm concerned there is no such thing as an original body that is beyond repair - if you can make a new one then you can repair the old one. As far as Bugattis are concerned I would go so far as to say that they are no longer real Bugattis once they have been rebodied.
The Galibier is a fine looking car but, of course, posers want to be seen and they can't be seen without the wind in their hair and the top down. That the practice goes on even today is appalling and it should be discouraged. It is rather like painting Madonna's face on the Mona Lisa because you think it will impress your friends as it is more beautiful.
The body on my car has not been off the chassis since it was built in 1929 despite over 300,000 miles. I don't stay at home because it rains but I do try to ensure that all the joints are waterproof since leaks are death to a Weymann body.


The older I get the better I was!
John S

What utter rubbish :D Usually things are very rare because they were not very popular.Or no good.The Atlantics are very noisy inside and rarely got driven.That is probably why there were not many more of these beautiful cars.The end user has an absolute right to body his car [just as the first owner had] in any way that suits him.To suggest that A Bugatti is no longer a Bugatti because it no longer has its [ not built by Bugatti ] original body is just ridiculous.Most Bugattis were sold in chassis form anyway.I would however qualify these comments by saying that it is wrong to remove a good usable body to make just another "le mans bentley" or whatever. There have always been derelict cars which really needed a new body and it is obviously better to start with one of those.As to whether the Galibier is a fine looking car I would suggest that beauty is in the eye of the beholder.To misquote the great HGC there have been prettier Bugatti bodies.
Author:  Johan Buchner [ Thu Mar 05, 2009 4:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another Galibier bites the dust.
It will come as no surprise to you, Dear Reader, that I am firmly with T44Lover on this one. However, the opportunity to play Devil's Advocate is too good to let slip, so here goes - How do you suppose we protect original coachwork? Shall we pass a law? Perhaps we can simply ban private ownership of cars? Yes, all cars belong to the State from now on. Then we form a committee, called the Politburo, to oversee the sensitive renovation of all remaining Bugattis, including those belonging to Ralph Lauren, Arturo Keller, all Frenchmen and the Schlumpf Museum. Of course being state-owned assets, only official state employees will be allowed to do the renovation. To achieve this, we will have to ban all private enterprise, and shoot the capitalists, lawyers and, especially, all M.G. owners.

Because I tell you, as things stand, the private owner can do with his Bugatti as he please. Today's Galibier is tomorrow's TT rip-off, and there is not a damn thing we can do about it. So you see, we have no choice but to institute a New World Order preventing such destruction. In this noble spirit of serving the Bugatti cause, I am hereby announcing my intention to become Dictator of ze Vorld, and all Bugattis shall be mine. I promise you I will protect them very carefully, EXK 6 will be repainted blue, Ralph Lauren will be flogged in public, all the Galibiers shall rise from the ashes, and all those traitors who believe the Alfa Romeo 8C 2.9 to be a superior automobile to the Type 57S will be sent to prison camps in Siberia -INDEFINITELY. There shall be a New Dawn.

Now, who's going to vote for me? ................. I'm not hearing anything.

Just you wait.
Johan
Author:  J.J.Horst [ Thu Mar 05, 2009 6:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another Galibier bites the dust.
Well Johan,

As you're the elected dictator now, you have the responsability of selling all your books, and with this money buy all obsolete Bugatti bodies.

There even is one currently on my site for sale, and of course I know somebody who owns some essential parts of said Galibier. They are for sale, at a good price!

Next step after that is to buy all Bugattis with new bodies, have them removed and reinstall the original bodies. Shortened chassis will have to be re-lengthened (and no, the blue pills often offered on this wonderful medium called internet won't work!). This project will need more than just the sale of your books, maybe the sale of a T50 book, to be written by you, will suffice to start that venture??
Author:  Johan Buchner [ Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another Galibier bites the dust.
Even though I am now officially the Dictator I still have to pay for Bugattis? Don't I get a secret police force to confiscate them? You know Jaap, just because I am now the All Powerful Ruler doesn't mean I have money. And if I am not going to get the Bugattis for free then I will not be The Dictator anymore, just you watch and see

And as for your revelation that it takes more than a few blue pills to lengthen a chassis, well that's a disaster innit? How else do you get the damn thing longer?

As for writing the T50 book - forget about it, I know less than Lebe Bugatti. My talent is for spending myself into the poor-house buying the works of real authors. And then bitching about them while I plagiarise their work on this forum. Good times.

Regards
Johan-the-penniless-librarian.
Author:  xlr8by [ Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another Galibier bites the dust.
T44lover wrote:
This thread is surely 'up my street'! I totally deplore the practice of rebodying pre-war cars of any make with replica bodies. As far as I'm concerned there is no such thing as an original body that is beyond repair - if you can make a new one then you can repair the old one. As far as Bugattis are concerned I would go so far as to say that they are no longer real Bugattis once they have been rebodied.
The Galibier is a fine looking car but, of course, posers want to be seen and they can't be seen without the wind in their hair and the top down. That the practice goes on even today is appalling and it should be discouraged. It is rather like painting Madonna's face on the Mona Lisa because you think it will impress your friends as it is more beautiful.
The body on my car has not been off the chassis since it was built in 1929 despite over 300,000 miles. I don't stay at home because it rains but I do try to ensure that all the joints are waterproof since leaks are death to a Weymann body.


The older I get the better I was!
John S

Mind sharing the chassis number and posting some pics? I agree with you, and I can not stand when a car is rebodied. Especially if the body on the chassis is in fine shape. I don't want to see a million grand prix bodied cars, that never left the factory like that! Now making the chassis shorter/longer and adding a new body, you might as well build a new car from the ground up! :) Just my 2 cents of course.
Erik
Author:  J.J.Horst [ Thu Mar 05, 2009 10:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Another Galibier bites the dust.
Johan Buchner wrote:
As for writing the T50 book - forget about it, I know less than Lebe Bugatti. My talent is for spending myself into the poor-house buying the works of real authors. And then bitching about them while I plagiarise their work on this forum. Good times.

Regards
Johan-the-penniless-librarian.

Of course, you have something that many authors lack, a way with entertaining, be it sometimes a bit offending, writing. Maybe a book on the T50 is too much, but of course you can write a history about Bugattis on the Internet (that's one that nobody ever thought of before!) including all the still-born sites and the few that still persist.

I trust you can write quite an interesting history about that, and of course nobody would mind you being offensive at times! :mrgreen:

Or do I know get this thread and the one about books mixed up??
Author:  Andrew [ Thu Jul 16, 2009 2:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Another Galibier bites the dust.
My father purchased a Type 57, which was originally a Gangloff Pillarless Galibier. It is now a Type 59/50B, modeled after the Jean Pierre Wilmille car that won the Grand Prix du Comminges in 1939.

Here is a picture of the car today (with me racing it at Watkins Glen in 2007):

Image

Jerry Sherman discarded the Gangloff Pillarless Galibier body and built an aluminum lighweight open body in order to use it for racing in VSCCA events in the 1960s. Below is a picture of the rebodied car.
Image
This car was then destroyed in a barn fire. Karl Larson, my father, purchased the frame and engine and rebuilt the Bugatti with Jim Stranberg of High Mountain Classics in Colorado. Entire history and a picture of the original Galibier body is on Page 166 of Vol. II of The Netherlands Belgium Bugatti Register 2008-2009.

I will see if I can find a picture of the original Galibier body to post.
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC + 1 hour
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/