About a Bugatti, strangely enough.

Johan Buchner · **Posted:** Fri Nov 14, 2008 12:46 pm

Last night on my way home I picked up the latest issue of Classic & Sports Car, knowing full well that an article on the fantastically original King Leopold T59 was awaiting within. So did I dive right in and read? Nope, I logged on and answered Uwe's query about the 1939 Le Mans T57G, got the answer horribly, horribly wrong, logged off in a huff, made myself some tea, and then only did I get to spend some quality time with the Bugatti. My Darlings, my Dears what a car that is! And the deep, profound originality is beyond mesmerising, it's sacred. Well known history, raced by the factory then 4 careful owners, now back in Europe (Belgium, I believe) and receiving another careful mechanical overhaul, patina to be kept intact, by Tim Dutton.

And then I read that the new owner is going to race it! Race it!? Why, why in the name of God must this priceless heirloom be risked racing? All it will take is one single dickhead in a Pur Sang T51 to wipe away 70 years of history. And it will happen, take my word for it, it will happen. And then what? Restoration of course, that's what. As it is but a handful of Bugattis remain original and this is the last un-restored T59. It cannot race, it is too precious for that! If the owner wants to race let him buy a bloody replica, that's what they're there for! The ignominy! The outrage! My helpless fury!

I will be in Europe next year, and if you read reports of a demented South African who got arrested while trying to drive a wooden stake through a Belgian's heart, you'll know why.

Racing indeed.

I weep
Johan

horseshoe · **Joined:** Sun Sep 21, 2008 10:52 pm **Posts:** 52

It'sbuild for it. race it and enjoy it and history is only a part of it. The car is better off when it is used where it is made for and that is racing. I hope to see it soon on the tracks.

superleggera · **Joined:** Sat Aug 09, 2008 4:13 am **Posts:** 97

Given how long it has sat and non-use -- it is definitely in need of some work from what I understand.

As for originality? It's a very used old racecar. It's big bonus is that it has a continious and interesting documented history post racing.

If it was ever damaged -- how do you "restore" it? To original GP configuration, sports car configuration (racer) or as the Leopold configuration?

Glad to hear it will be vintage raced and hopefully will be used on the road as a true "sports car" as it later became after its GP / sportcar racing days were over. Definitely one of my favorite Bugatti's.

hortig78rpm · **Joined:** Thu Jun 19, 2008 12:12 pm **Posts:** 247

my friend johann

should this car be a static exhibit in a dining room? take the
kurt kiefer`s T 46. it`s as far as I know the only bugatti in the same ownership as new. always being rallied or raced and never restored.

there are several race-cars in the world, more famous and even rarer
than the ex-leopold T59, which are raced today as the 1914 winning mercedes, a 19o5 franklin racer, and even the most famous racing car on earth, the 1892 panhard , which is now to do the race from bordeux to paris again, absolutley original car, kept by the panhard family since new !!!!

it`s more a shame, that I think the famous tritignant T51, rescued by
raffaelli had lost his patina and is now restored........

Herman · **Posted:** Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:42 am

Race it, fix it when necessary, and race it again. Actually Bugattis are, from a construction point of view, relatively simple cars, so might something bad happen, a replacement frame or bodywork can be arranged.

And besides that, vintage racing is not rallyecross....

Lazarus · **Posted:** Sat Nov 15, 2008 1:26 pm

After the big fire in Rob Walkers garage,the chassis of the GP [Seaman] Delage was touching the ground in the middle ! And many aluminium castings were melted.Everything was straightened and patterns made for castings and today it is of course the same car again.Great work by John Chisman and Paul Jameson.I have to say however that I am not really in favour of racing such cars seriously.A car like the T59 in question has earned a gentle retirement with occasional demonstrations to show what she was capable of all those years ago.Metal fatigue is quite well understood by a few and not perhaps appreciated by the majority.It is irriversible.Maybe we should enjoy them while we may?

Johan Buchner · **Posted:** Sat Nov 15, 2008 1:59 pm

Philistines! Heretics! Just you people wait, this car will be crashed and it will be fixed and the originality will be lost - forever. Yes, this car must be put in a glass box and never ever raced. Exhibited on a track, perhaps, but then only in the company of other equally historic vehicles. Its the billionaire yahoo's in replica's which should be feared. They believe they are racers, and they do not give a stuff about the cars, they care only for their own empty glory.

My opinion stands.

Johan

Greg Morgan · **Joined:** Wed Aug 13, 2008 12:10 am **Posts:** 334

I saw the car in its dissasembled state last week and it was strange to see it with the cowl removed and its old original radiator on show.

horseshoe · **Joined:** Sun Sep 21, 2008 10:52 pm **Posts:** 52

A crashed Bugatti on display will also attrack more people to a museum, specialy if you make a tableau with an old ambulance an a firetender. May be the 59 is an idea :lol:

hortig78rpm · **Joined:** Thu Jun 19, 2008 12:12 pm **Posts:** 247

dear johann

everybody should do what he likes. they have payed millions to own such a car, why not drive/race them?? or do you think it`s better to move them into the garage with one outing a year?? why should wine-collectors not drink their 1898 rothschild? why shoult shellack-fans not play their records although through easy breaking it can be lost for all time ??
maybe you know about george F. wingard, who owned 7 original racers from the time before WW.I. they all have been driven in various events, laguna beach, goodwood, prescott and are still in their original form, except
the left rear wheel of the 19o8 benz GP car, which collapsed years
ago while racing at laguna beach. please , have a look into:
" youtube" with dieppe 2oo8 or mercedes 19o8 . you ll see them racers
making the centary race of the dieppe GP again......

and with all of my love for bugatti, the T59 is not the masterpiece, that should be put into a shrine for preservation.....

regards
mike

Herman · **Posted:** Sun Nov 16, 2008 10:52 am

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nN8Mh0vuCak

Johan Buchner · **Posted:** Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:33 pm

Of course an owner has the right to do with his property as it pleases him. If the owner wants to sacrifice the last untouched T59 on the altar of his own ego, he is free to do so. But please do not expect me to sacrifice my right to freedom of expression when this car's originality is destroyed. It is the owners right to race this car ; it is my right to mourn this wanton destruction in any way I see fit. This Belgian does not need my permission : This South African does not need his either.

Sen. Wingard fabulous collection of pre-WW1 racers are all restored cars, very well restored, but restored nevertheless. A restored car can be restored any number of times, but originality is finite. All it takes is one incident, and the King Leopold T59's untouched condition is lost forever ; what happens then, whether it be a sensitive renovation or a Paul Russell remanufacture, is irrelevant - something indefinable and irreplaceable will be gone forever.

My opinion, as always, is utterly irrelevant. But I will not be silenced ; for evil to triumph etc.

Johan Buchner

J.J.Horst · **Posted:** Sun Nov 16, 2008 6:28 pm

Maybe you will not be silenced, but it may be time for you to shut up.

Bugattis were made to be driven, if you want something static, buy the Mona Lisa, that was made to hang from the wall!

Especially original Bugattis should be driven, though maybe there should be a separate race class for "not so original" Bugattis.

And, is this car original? It is by far not as it left the factory, it was changed half a dozen times. What is the "original" configuration of this car (though I like very much the current one!)?

So: ALL Bugattis should be used for what they were intended; driven, and driven hard!

If not; buy a Rolls Royce or something....

Herman · **Posted:** Sun Nov 16, 2008 6:42 pm

Before any of you two people start catfighting, please do that over the E-mail, and not in this forum please.

Timmmmmmmmmmy · **Joined:** Sun Nov 16, 2008 9:38 pm **Posts:** 3

What the owner should consider IMO is perhaps replacing anything likely to break with as original components, keeping the originals safe somewhere as and when they want to stop racing this way the carr can easily be made SAFE for racing and anything irreplacable wont be put in harms way. And so long as the original parts are replaced with other original parts (even new parts made to original specs) there will be absolutely no risk.

And after the owner has given up racing it can all be put together again and then displayed in a museum or some such. AND IMO much better raced than locked away where NO-ONE but the owner will ever see it again. ??

Tim

About a Bugatti, strangely enough.

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