the price for the T57sc seems altright, for I never could understand the for my opinion too high price for the williamson one last year. but really
interesting are the 2, 2 millions for black bess. this is really an all time high.

mike

Does anybody know the results for the other Buggattis in the Bonhams sale at Retromobile?

Auction results (includes buyers premium):

Lot 110 57319 166 750 €
Lot 114 T18 chassis #474 (Black Bess) 2 427 500 €
Lot 142 57502 3 417 500 €
Lot 151 T35 parts (not sold)
Lot 165 57158 306 700 €
Lot 169 T13 chassis #442 (not sold)

Anybody got any pics of 57158? It was very pretty from a distance.

An "all time high"? Compared to what? Compared all the other T18's that have recently changed hands?
Bugwrench

The price for the T57S is way out of line. The photoshoot from Bonham is a real piece of art. The car looked patined and reparable, but when you saw the car in reallife it was very disappointing. a lot more damage than I expected from the pictures. It need a complete overhaul and restauration and what is the consequense for future projects. Bugatti's seems to become unaffordable and therefore undrivable. Or is this theatre with the T57S a preplanned show in order to prove to the world that the recession does not effect the high end of the classic car industry. Even Bonham has to prove their exsistance.

Horseshoe

bugwrench

all-time-high. these amounts only reached a few bugattis: royale, the monaco winning T35, the T57sc, but not a pre WWI bugatti or any other
one. so I used this term. the price, ettore`s ventoux racing T18 reached during the high price days in the late 8o/early 9o`s was one third of that of black bess.

mike

Mike, sorry, I completely understand what you wanted to say but I jumped on your wording because in my view the price for such a rare and early Ettore piece of art can not easily be compared to his later cars that have been produced in much higher quantities.
Bugwrench

I agree with you that Bugattis have become so expensive that the "investment type" rather than the "user type" of owner will decide to only use the car for hype events like PB.
Fortunately both the high end Bonhams cars ended up with the "user type" of owner and even more important with European owners that I known to keep the cars as much as possible as is.'
Bugwrench

quite right you are ,bugwrench, but compared with the second T18 which was ever on the market with nearly the same interesting history ( ettore`s winnig car at the ventoux hillclimb) the price is astonishingly high.
and as I remember . the second oldest bugatti, once owned by mdme. bugatti also did`nt even reach one million.

and for my opinion, a former race car of ettore is historicially more interesting than a large prominent english ownership .

roland garros: in the nuseum at compiegne, there is a small sigma car which also belongt to that french flying ace of WWI.

bugatti`in yours
mike

[/quote] If I had these sort of sums to spend I would much rather have the T18 than the ridiculous T57 needing complete restoration.I cannot see a T57 at more than 500.000 euros.They are not really that rare.Not even an original bugatti blower.

BTW, the car should be called a 57S not an SC as some people do.
Bugwrench

hallo lazarus

and I even would better like the unsold T13, for this really is a nice little car: weight the enemy.......

i really can imagine, what the little car will look like, if somebody will fit
a hood......


regards
mike

So what does Bleck Bess weigh? That really is not at all a big car!

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sorry jap, I meant that for the little T13, which was also on sale but unsold
I remember a headline slogan after the racing success of 1911 in similar words due the victory of a small car against the monstreous fiat`s, itala`s
and so on.
and for shure you remember my love to the pre WWI bugattis....

regards
mike